For some context, we are first generation immigrants. My parents are Russian, my mother and her husband have been living here for 20 years (even got rid of Russian citizenship couple years ago), my biological father is still living in Russia.
It’s damn exhausting to discuss political topics with them, especially my father. He keeps telling me how great it is to live in Russia, how their economy is doing great and how he’s proud that they are defending their “brothers” in Donezk and Luhansk from the evil bandera regime in Ukraine.
My mom voted far right in the past election. She doesn’t believe she voted for nazis, but the party’s views on economics, climate policy and immigration seem to align with hers. She believes wind farms are harmful for the environment. What the actual fuck.
Whenever I try to argue with them, they tell me that I’ve been brainwashed by “Western propaganda”.
I’m at a loss. I love my parents and I know that nobody’s immune to propaganda, but it’s heartbreaking to see them holding these toxic beliefs. How would you deal with parents like these? Should I just declare to never talk about politics with them again since it’s pointless?
Books or audio books on the subject of cults and conspiracy theories help to both understand this and eventually know what to do about it.
Unfortunately, you arguing with them about it most likely did only damage and no good. Stop. It will only make your parents more right wing (and you left) then drive you both crazy.
Here is a good place to start if you like: Hivemind by A.Montell Cultish BA S.cavanagh
Hit me up if you want more. But it’s a complicated subject that can’t be explained in a short lemmy post. If you want any other advice, OP, eatsomeveggies.
Just avoid the conversations. You can’t change their mind.
I have conservative parents. I’m hoping it will personally affect their lives enough that they understand how ignorant and irrational they’re being.
If they’re drawing social security or on Medicare you may get your wish soon.
Or just show them video of trump talking about how he’s going to slash entitlements.
Tell them what you think and then cut them out of your life. That is what I have done. Fuck their nonsense.
This is way overkill. If political opinions are the only issue you are having with your parents, then just avoid talking about politics. It’s that simple. Cutting them out of your life over something like that is cruel, silly and dramatic.
That really depends on the political views. If someone’s belief is that certain groups do not deserve to exist/live, or at least doesn’t care enough about those views of the party they voted for, that is absolutely reason enough to cut them out of your life.
If you’re set on doing this you need to accept you may never be successful.
Also it has to be something gentle, not necessarily subtle, but compassionate. If you don’t accept that they believe in their views then they will only feel attacked and lash out for defense.
As for actually changing their views, choose one or two things that you can point to in examples they can observe. Propaganda has a very hard time defeating our own eyes and ears. I don’t even know which country you’re in so you’ll have to figure that out for yourself.
Another way to change their views is to get them to volunteer with organizations that help people down on their luck. A lot of times, just hearing the stories of how people ended up in need of help can change attitudes.
Ghost them as soon as possible and leave the country and naturalise elsewhere if possible
Well, one of mine died and it turns out the other one turned Trumper because she had developed dementia so I don’t hold it against her.
Have you tried that?
Idk death and dementia don’t seem like a feasible solution to me
You don’t owe your parents anything. Cut them out of your life entirely if you need to and are able to. Otherwise either keep standing your ground and try to keep converting them, or just make it clear that you won’t discuss politics.
Both your parents sound slightly worse than my dad, who I went no-contact with for several years
Are they, especially your mom, different in person?
I have this one aunt who will hold forth in any crowd, insisting on whatever conspiracy theory she read on Facebook most recently. It’s tiring to the point that most of my adult life I’ve avoided her at family get togethers. But last time I saw her, just before pandemic, we happened into conversation away from everyone else. She came across lucid, intelligent, and we had a good conversation. wtf? Where has all that been?
My therapist made a really great point when I brought up this exact issue with him. He asked if I value a relationship with my parents, and I said yes. Then he said that the price you have to pay for having a relationship with them, is never discussing politics.
It worked for a year or so, but then they voted for that rapist again, and I’ve since cut them out of my life. I’m not walking around on the eggshells of their bigotry and ignorance just so I can get some semblance of what some may describe as affection. You can only say/do so many shitty terrible things before I’m just done with you completely, and they hit their limit, so it was time to cash out.
Sorry, my advice of ignoring politics only works for a little while.
If you don’t mind me asking, how often did politics come up with your parents?
Edit: just for my own perspective, they came up a little with my father while he was still alive and very, very rarely with my mother who I still see daily. I gently gauge the political position that my kids have but I’ve raised them all with empathy as a central tenet of their upbringing so that’s more or less where they tend to fall as best I can tell.
I am not interested in ending up where you did and I mean that with kindness.
Rapist? You mean Bill Clinton? Or Biden, who showered with his 16 year old daughter?
Oh. Wow. Really stupid. I’m so sorry
Well, you do know Ol Bill was at Epstein Island sword fighting with Trump.
Good thing I didn’t vote for either of them or Biden in 2024.
I’m gonna need to see the receipts on this one. Sounds like some ‘pizza dungeon’ tripe.
Clinton was impeached for, at best, getting busy with a staff member. Maybe you have a different opinion, but I have a hard time believing things would have gotten as far as it did publicly if what truly happened was just some banal impropriety. Oh my, he got a blowjob from a college aged staffer? I doubt there are many presidents who haven’t. Why did this get far enough for immediate public knowledge?
Biden… before AI image generation took off, the magats made tons of compilations of pictures and videos of him making young girls obviously uncomfortable. Too much to just write off as coincidence or bad timing of photos. The bathing with his 16 year old daughter was from public statements made by the alleged victim, stating that it had happened.
Beyond all that, I have to get this off my chest: Y’all motherfuckers believe Epstein island is real (and it was), but you draw the line of believability at: “There’s no possible way the global elite could have sex trafficking infrastructure in the area surrounding a common meeting location. They would never use such obvious code language around pizza and pizza toppings. You know, the code language that can be verified to have been used by pedos on 4chan in the clearnet and that’s also been noted by darknet reseachers.”
I’m not saying the trumptards were 3000% correct to target a specific business owner, or it was in any way OK to condemn by public opinion without any true investigation.
But you are certifiably insane if you somehow don’t think that the elite have human trafficking services including heinously illegal and horrendous shit available at practically every port of call. That’s basic fucking kompromat generation tactics that most intel orgs the world over would be chomping at the bit to support. Fuckers.
I know I keep my tinfoil hat nice and shiny on this shit, but of all the things to push back against, you choose “The fellows at the top are likely rapists”?
OMG
I was born in PRC, and I immigrated to the US along with my family. They just look at WeChat all day, and regurgitate CCP propaganda, and also pro-maga propaganda which is kinda an interesting combo of propagandas, considering how maga is always anti-China. Keeps blaming Democrats for the “migrant crisis” like BRUH we are immigrants 🤦♂️.
They left for economic (and to some degree political) reasons. Its fucking hard to get a job in mainland China, like theres 1.4 billion people ye know what I mean. And there’s no unions, no strikes, no workplace safety, no labor rights.
Yea they look at their current Union job in the US and still be like: “China wasn’t that bad”
Also funny thing is: I was the second child to be born in my family… during the One Child Policy… 👀
So I was not supposed to be born, my parents violated CCP policy, and they would’ve killed me (as in a forced abortion) if they found me, so my mother had to hide until I was born, but even then, I didn’t have legal documents (like birth certificates) until they paid a massive fine.
AND THEY ARE STILL SYMPATHETIC TO THE CCP 🤦♂️
Gee, thanks mom, guess if you love CCP so much, just let them take you away and force an abortion? At least I wouldn’t have to deal with this fucked up world.
Like, that’s my best argument against them every time they bring up pro-CCP views, I’d just be like (in Cantonese, obviously): “So you agree they should’ve killed me? Why didn’t you just let them then?” that shuts them up every time.
I mean, this world is so bizzare, I feel like I’m on some Truman Show and everyone is just messing with me
That is all… massively fucked up.
I’m thinking that it’s hard for them to be anti-CCP when all of their lives have had CCP propaganda as their main source of information, and moving abroad doesn’t really break that bond since the familiarity is still available online.
And of course CCP doesn’t seem so bad when they’re compared to the “alternative” as portrayed by the CCP.
Think about attending the funerals if you need the closure but you’re under no obligation.
There is a way to deradicalize people. It’s not easy, but it’s possible. I’m surprised this isn’t more common information now, but here it is.
You need to understand that each of us builds our beliefs on a set of ideological structures. We believe in policies because of principles. We believe in principles because of foundations. All of these ideas reinforce each other and create our sense of self. Preservation of the self is the highest imperative, and so people resist persuasion with increasing ferocity the more foundational an idea feels to their sense of self.
The way around this is to convince them that their foundational beliefs support a different concept. In many ways, it’s actually a bit like the premise of the Christopher Nolan film “Inception” without the technology: the person needs to essentially feel like they themselves discovered whatever idea you’re trying to convince them of, based on their existing beliefs.
This means first understanding what their core beliefs are and why they feel that these support the policies and identies you’re trying to change. Then you need to identify what can serve as a replacement, and find a way to get them to see the replacement as more appealing.
To put this into practice, can you tell me what you’d describe as their underlying principles? What are their fears and desires that shape their values? Common examples for conservatives include fear of change; a belief that life is a ruthless zero-sum game, and that we all most look out for our tribe or we will be exploited and subjugated by our adversaries. Conviction that tradition is a guide to keep us safe from reckless thinking, and that prescribed social roles and hierarchies are essential for our very survival.
If that’s the case, you can’t argue for progressivism by trying to convince them that we should all just love each other and welcome immigrants and that gender and sexual freedom are socially good. It’s like trying to talk them into jumping off a bridge. Instead, you need to explain how if you want to look out for yourself and your family, you should do it in a different way. And these politicians who sound so convincing are secretly the kind of people that they already don’t trust.
Keep in mind that replacing their faith in these kinds of leaders with your preferred political leaders is likely folly. People don’t invert their ideological identities. You need a replacement that is a good match, and because politics are often polar, a better substitute for dangerous political attachments are often simply outside of politics entirely. This may be non-partisan faith communities or sports teams or local social clubs. But if you can find a new story that fits into their existing theory of the world and satisfies their ideological needs better than right-wing politics, you CAN get people to slowly stop watching YouTube conspiracy videos or stop spending their time in far-right Facebook groups in favor of something healthier.
All of this is hard to do, but it CAN be done. I find it very frustrating that this info is still somehow obscure considering how essential it is these days.
I’m of the opinion that a lot of conservatives would stop being conservatives if they could magically gain the ability to feel empathy.
Give them some MDMA
Psychedelics were like hitting fast-forward on getting through all that shit. I would’ve gotten there eventually, I think, maybe, but mushrooms were like a one-day intensive crash course to make it all click.
Fucking amen. Nothing makes me feel more connected to the universe than a shroom meditation
I cut them off.
When I was younger, I would have argued till I was blue in the face. I’ve since learned to choose my battles and not waste my time and energy on battles I know I can’t win… so I’d leave it alone as much as they allowed it, and eventually refuse to discuss it at all if needed.
