Yeah why dance all night when you can go join a mob and shout angrily at passersby all day?
I think their issue is everyone getting it. In American culture and Christianity, love must be conditional.
Only correct behaviour would mean you get rewarded/supported.
Their issue isn’t giving it away for free, their issue is not being able to classify certain members of society as a underclass that don’t deserve anything unless they conform to their values.
So it’s about power and control. Universal health care means you have no power over these individuals and what values they live by.
To be clear, it isn’t free healthcare. In Canada we pay our taxes and the government administers the health insurance system. In Ontario where I live it’s the Ontario Health Insurance Plan. It covers most doctors visits and most treatments. I have Hodgins Lymphoma and am nearing the end of my treatment. Dozens of doctors visits, CT scans, x-rays, an echo cardiogram, a respiratory study, two PET scans, and all the drugs and the only thing I’ve paid for out of pocket is parking, and the hospital where I’m being treated just put in free parking for cancer patients and gave me a parking pass. Our government negotiates the price of drugs at the national level and regulates drug prices. Companies aren’t allowed to raise the price of a drug that is on the market unless there is a corresponding improvement in benefit to the patient. They can’t add a coloured band to a capsule, rename the drug (Losec to Prilosec, for example) and double or triple the price. Generic drugs are the same. That’s why epipens are $100 here and not $600 like in the US. There has been no substantion improvement in their benefit to patients so the price can’t go up.
Universal healthcare isn’t perfect but 22 of 23 highly developed countries in the world have it and the US profits before people system is grotesque.
I don’t think many Americans in favor of universal healthcare think it’s going to cost nothing. Of course, taxes will increase. But we already pay for private healthcare. Most of us via a payroll deduction.
We do as well. I have private coverage for things that OHIP doesn’t cover like a private hospital room, massage, physio, and other therapies, eye glasses, dental, and prescription drugs. It’s much, much cheaper than in the US because it is single payer and heavily regulated.
They don’t want the possibility of helping everyone, there could be someone they don’t like in there!
She just wants to dance
There’s no virtue signalling in paying taxes
Make a big show of making your tax records public
But there could be
Charity is the bandaid covering a societal failure
I once tried to explain this to someone Christian, they just called me selfish.
A bandaid that lets wealthy people get an ego boost and a tax write off
Let’s not forget that they create charitable ‘foundations’ which then work with lawmakers to create legislation, thus giving themselves greater influence over the relevant laws as well.
I don’t like the term “free healthcare”, because most of us would be paying for it in taxes, it would be more accurate to call it “socialized healthcare”.
Saying “I want free healthcare” allows the media to twist your words and make you look like some “entitled brat” that “want everything for free”.
Insurance is already a socialized program- just a private one. Creating public health care simply removes the profit incentive.
Universal healthcare
Or ya know, simply Public Healthcare. Because it’s for public. End of topic.
It sort of is free though.
With private healthcare your coverage price goes up with medical needs. So the one time you need healthcare is the one time that you have to pay more for it.
With socialized healthcare you just pay the same base rate as everyone else, regardless of if you have complicated medical needs or not. Also in socialized healthcare if you don’t have a job you don’t pay anything, but you still get medical care.
Keep it simple and call it “healthcare”. No need to qualify it with anything.
The ones who still think Obamacare and ACA are different things definitely need a catchy label and marketing if they’re gonna vote for it.
Or just lie to them, their own leaders have learned it doesn’t matter what you tell them. Call it the “everyone gets a puppy” Bill or whatever. Then tell them they got a free puppy. They won’t know they didn’t.
They won’t know they didn’t.
We have concepts for a puppy.
That was a bit of hyperbole. But we could always say “if you didn’t get a free puppy, it’s because Trump and his Republicans hate puppies”
This is exactly what we need to do. Its literally the only way to combat a populace that simply does not want to be educated. Just fuckin lie, then post your actual platform online. People who actually care will read it, everyone else will think that the dems are campaigning on eliminating the sun to cool the earth during the summer, and during the winter well just tow a new sun to orbit.
Counter-point: calling it universal/single-payer distinguishes it from what we have now. Which I would argue isn’t actually healthcare, at least by modern standards in other countries…
Yeah, we don’t have healthcare. We have profit-motivated health insurance. We pay in case we get injured or sick, and they only profit if they find a legitimate way to not cover us when we get injured or sick, so they try their damnedest to do that.
It healthcare has a own risk (literal translation, I’m not sure about the English term) in which the first costs are out of pocket until you reach a certain amount (400-800 depending on your insurance package).
So it’s not ‘free’ as you don’t pay for all of it, but you can’t go into crippling debt over medical payments.
I think you’re talking about deductibles. But in the truly socialized healthcare system you wouldn’t have deductibles anyway because you don’t pay out of pocket for anything.
Under the UK system you do pay for some drugs as an outpatient, but we’re only talking like £6 (honestly it makes you wonder why they bother). But you never pay for in-house medicine and you don’t pay for procedures at all.
I was just arguing against the ‘free’ bit of the argument. But I agree with you.
But that sounds like socialism! We can’t have that!
That would be like having some kind of socially based security!
Single payer healthcare is fine.
The single payer is the government
The government doesn’t have any money. They decide how to spend our taxes…
The government doesn’t get money from taxes. It prints money, the taxes are how it removes money from circulation.
Freedom Care! Patriot Care!
Name it whatever. How do we get it?
'Muricare
Love it!
Thats the problem. The media and too much of the usa wouldnt accept “socialized healthcare” becuase that sounds like socialism and enough people arent educated enough to know what that really means
Medicare For All
Universal Healthcare
Single-Payer System
Whatever, someone needs better PR
Medicare for all is so easy too.
Like literally just adding “for all” to the existing system.
And nixing health insurance companies. It’s a win win!
You didn’t even put an Instagram filter on it. Are you even trying?
In countries with government provided healthcare for all, we still do dance marathons to pay for bits of it. Ugh maybe it’s just the UK.
The marathons and stuff are to raise money for research more than to raise money for healthcare.
In my country there are multiple foundations and charity events, but these mainly aim to equip hostpitals rather than fund care. New equipment costs a lot in quantity hospitals need, and on gov money it would slowly trickle in. Meanwhile such events and foundations can greatly boost the speed of modernization.
There are aims to help with care funding, but that’s pretty much explicitly cancer cases where we need top-of-the-line treatments that are not available on public healthcare.
I just clap on my doorstep like a true philanthropist
Nah Canada does it too
the last Leafs game I was watching had an ad from Scarborough General Hospital begging for money and a Dug Ford ad big upping how easy it is to get care in Ontario in the same commercial break
Heading that way in Australia too
Charity is our choice. Taxes are the force of the government. Everything you want funded by others should be funded by charity. We shouldn’t be forced to pay for each other’s choices.
The problem with being a sovereign citizen is that in order to tell everyone about it you have to use government funded infrastructure which rather dilutes your message. Not that it was particularly coherent to begin with.
Then why are my insurance premiums paying for other people’s illnesses? Why don’t I get to decide how and when my insurance pays out? It’s my insurance paid with my money. Also, who keeps building all these roads and bridges with my tax money? I shouldn’t be forced to pay for infrastructure I don’t use just because someone chose to live somewhere else!
Insurance is a protection racket made to benefit a small cadre. They just managed to sneak it in to law and make the government require it. And you’re correct, you shouldn’t be forced to pay for something you’ll never use.
So your plan is to let poor sick people die, the same plan as the insurance companies, interesting. And it’s safe to assume you only use roads that you personally build and maintain, right?
Nobody chooses to get cancer. But everybody benefits from a society that lifts others up instead of kicks them when they’re down. If you don’t believe in helping other people then you’re just a sad individual.
Don’t use roads or sidewalks or parks or eat food or buy anything that has to follow safety regulations then.
And never sue anyone ever. Courts are expensive!
The stuff the government does that he likes is the will of the people. The parts he is trained to think are bad are forced on him.
No, it’s all done by force if it’s paid for by taxes, whether I like it or not. It’s just whether I’d have chosen to contribute or paid a private business.
Paying a business to do everything is how we got mining towns that paid their workers in company money that can only be used at company stores.
This is an acceptable thing to believe if you’re a teenager or younger. Past that it’s just embarrassing.
It’s what most MEGA supporters believe. Well, I say believe but that rather implies that they’ve thought about it, it’s what they’ve been told to parrot.
Which I suspect is what we’re dealing with here.
I don’t deserve to die.
