That’s true, but whataboutism doesn’t help much in a thread about the US election. Besides, in hardly any other democratic country in the world is the far-right or fascist candidate so obviously completely unsuitable: Trump has already been president and has previously made policies contrary to the interests of the idiots who voted for him; he has a criminal record for fraud and has been found guilty in various proceedings for many other crimes, such as sexual harassment, defamation and fraud amounting to millions. It doesn’t get any more obvious than that.
Yeah but so many people here didn’t vote for him and are just as appalled, so when we’re lumped in with the people who did vote for him that’s gonna make people pretty defensive
Yes, I get that of course. I’m sorry for you and every other US citizen that did not vote for him. I’m from Europe and still posted some anti-Trump stuff because I despise him and everything he stands for. I think he is a threat for the whole world.
Errr… México says hi, we elected the fascist one by a huge landslide and it’s been doing fascist things since day 1 so… Even when it’s extremely obvious, people will still pick the worst one if it has enough astrosurfing behind them.
We’re doing shit about it too, still acting as if the fascists party would listen to reason and not as their cult leader tells them to.
I’m from Germany and here, too, the fascists are unfortunately on the rise again - despite our terrible past. I realize, of course, that you can’t talk sense to them because they simply ignore arguments and cling uncritically to the lies of their leaders. Nevertheless, I think the situation in the USA is somewhat different, because Trump was already president in pretty much everyone’s lifetime and has only made policy for the super-rich; he has also been convicted of fraud several times and has also enriched himself from the general public (the list goes on). You would think that those who are not die-hard fascists, of which there are probably many, would take this as an opportunity to see through his lies about a better life for the little people. But unfortunately that didn’t happen, I can’t for the life of me understand why not. I mean if you understand stupidity as the inability to learn from mistakes, it seems extremely stupid to me to vote for Trump even a second time.
You think people go around understanding and learning, trying to be better or to prevent others from suffering the same fate… but you are wrong, most humans are resentful assholes, who only care about themselves and are happy with all the astrosurfing and the chance to be assholes to others, I suffered because of X, so you have to suffer through Y while I laugh at you.
The same thing happened here in México, the puppet’s campaign was empty, just promising to keep doing what the expresident told her to… and that was enough to win, nobody cared for anything else, just the promise to bribe the lowest class and force the rest into lowering their life quality.
I’ve been saying this for a while, but they abuse that decent people try to be tolerant of them, not to make them angry or insult them, trying to be the reasonable ones… if we keep this way they are going to keep going with nobody standing up to them.
OC said America was full of stupid people. I can’t see how that means that the US would be the only country full of stupid people. Of course there are lots and lots of stupid people elsewhere. Pointing that out in the context of the US election sure sounds like whataboutism to me. My only point is that it does not make things any better just because there are other countries with similar issues. But I see what you mean and think you are right: maybe other countries can learn something from this debacle - I don’t have much hope anymore in that regard but we will see.
No, of course not. It’s just that even people from other countries are pissed because the US elected Trump a second time. Now we have to deal with his horrible policies again. I personally think the man is a threat for the whole democratic world and because of his horrible positions on climate change and other issues even for the whole world.
And you’re right about all this, but calling us all idiots specifically is not helpful. Millions of Americans are incredibly upset by this. It will be disastrous and there’s not a fucking thing we can do. We voted and it didn’t matter.
I’m sorry if you took my comment that way. I’m really the very last person who wants to lump an entire country together. My point was simply that this election has once again shown that there are significant problems in the US (education, racism, corruption, inequality, etc.) that have allowed Trump to deceive the population yet again. To relativize now by pointing out that things are just as bad or even worse elsewhere in the world only distracts from the real issue in my opinion. Nevertheless, I wish you all the best and very much hope that you can somehow put a stop to Trump’s greed and his terrible ideology.
No. You acted as though u had the right to tell me what to do and that i was a bad for how i was born. U judged me by the colour of my skin not the quality if my charecter, and i dont like that.
Oh okay, so trannies are your thing… whatever, colonialism and white supremacy were examples. You can say whatever you want, dude, and you clearly have on any number of occasions. Don’t mistake us calling you out for your bullshit for suppression of your free speech. As a self-proclaimed retard, I’m guessing you probably don’t fully understand the issues you’re talking about. I’d be more likely to call you ignorant, which is fine, because ignorance can be cured.
This is an example to good to be true. My comment was deleted but its fine for you to say “trannies” and “retard”. I couldnt prove my point any better if i tried.
Well, I was making fun of your speech patterns but I would understand if the mods want to delete my comment. I think there’s at least some understanding of intent here on lemmy. You clearly either don’t understand gender dysphoria and are proud of your ignorance, or you are just legitimately transphobic. Or maybe a little bit of both. Regardless, getting moderated on an internet forum is not a violation of your free speech either. You said it, I responded to it. We’re having a conversation. Free speech. You don’t get to yell the n word in the lobby of a hotel either.
Why must i be a queer person of colour? Sounds like ur saying im not allowed to think or say this without being a queer person of colour. Did u just prove my point?
You can apply all of this to the Trump conservative movement, except that systemic oppression and power imbalances are treated as natural, and thus (at best) not something we need to be concerned about.
“The Trump conservative movement is a social and philosophical movement that prioritizes identity politics, cultural Marxism, and social constructivism.” - some guy on lemmy
I mean, Trump conservatism is clearly influenced and informed by post-modernist philosophy. Social constructivism is there in spades. Identity politics predate all of this and have been used by both sides extensively over time. Cultural Marxism… I’m not even sure what it is - sort of an amalgam of critical theory and (((them)))? Okay, you got me on that one.
I’d love Karl’s view on Putin/Russia right now… You’re right trying to find a meaning for that nonsense phrase. I remember doing a web search when I first read it - maybe it meant something. Beyond the reference sites it was all US right wing publications using the term. If only one section of one society is using a phrase that should tell you something about the phrase.
Imagine I was hungry and you kindly served up a platter of exotic and mysterious food but right in the middle of it there was a festering lump of rotten meat… suddenly I wouldn’t be so hungry. That’s how I feel whenever I encounter that term. There’s no great bogeyman controlling things - it’s just that humanity is slowly moving away from its obsession with invisible sky men telling everyone how to live.
I’m more than happy to ponder the “sociopolitical concept” of an ongoing culture war that may (or may not) be taking place in western civilisation. The term “Cultural Marxism” is, in and of itself, at best, a conspiracy theory dressed in its Sunday best. I’m sorry the food analogy was lost on you. I was trying to say that those two words turned me off everything else you were saying. The sky man crowd are generally the largest contingent against the “culturally Marxist” shift in society so I thought I’d give them a shout out, for their troubles.
And yeah the left and right of the political spectrum as well as the top and bottom are conjoined. Effectively the political spectrum is topologically a torus.
One thing I have noticed is that conservatives everywhere absolutely want to tell everyone else what to do, while crying like little snowflakes about ‘wokeism’ (and none of them can answer what it is).
If u could read u would see my definition in responce to the guy who asked. I really wouldnt consider myself a conservative either but since im not with you i must be your enemy.
This is happening all over the world. The USA are just a little further ahead compared to Europe.
That’s true, but whataboutism doesn’t help much in a thread about the US election. Besides, in hardly any other democratic country in the world is the far-right or fascist candidate so obviously completely unsuitable: Trump has already been president and has previously made policies contrary to the interests of the idiots who voted for him; he has a criminal record for fraud and has been found guilty in various proceedings for many other crimes, such as sexual harassment, defamation and fraud amounting to millions. It doesn’t get any more obvious than that.
Yeah but so many people here didn’t vote for him and are just as appalled, so when we’re lumped in with the people who did vote for him that’s gonna make people pretty defensive
Yes, I get that of course. I’m sorry for you and every other US citizen that did not vote for him. I’m from Europe and still posted some anti-Trump stuff because I despise him and everything he stands for. I think he is a threat for the whole world.
Errr… México says hi, we elected the fascist one by a huge landslide and it’s been doing fascist things since day 1 so… Even when it’s extremely obvious, people will still pick the worst one if it has enough astrosurfing behind them.
We’re doing shit about it too, still acting as if the fascists party would listen to reason and not as their cult leader tells them to.
I’m from Germany and here, too, the fascists are unfortunately on the rise again - despite our terrible past. I realize, of course, that you can’t talk sense to them because they simply ignore arguments and cling uncritically to the lies of their leaders. Nevertheless, I think the situation in the USA is somewhat different, because Trump was already president in pretty much everyone’s lifetime and has only made policy for the super-rich; he has also been convicted of fraud several times and has also enriched himself from the general public (the list goes on). You would think that those who are not die-hard fascists, of which there are probably many, would take this as an opportunity to see through his lies about a better life for the little people. But unfortunately that didn’t happen, I can’t for the life of me understand why not. I mean if you understand stupidity as the inability to learn from mistakes, it seems extremely stupid to me to vote for Trump even a second time.
You think people go around understanding and learning, trying to be better or to prevent others from suffering the same fate… but you are wrong, most humans are resentful assholes, who only care about themselves and are happy with all the astrosurfing and the chance to be assholes to others, I suffered because of X, so you have to suffer through Y while I laugh at you.
The same thing happened here in México, the puppet’s campaign was empty, just promising to keep doing what the expresident told her to… and that was enough to win, nobody cared for anything else, just the promise to bribe the lowest class and force the rest into lowering their life quality.
I’ve been saying this for a while, but they abuse that decent people try to be tolerant of them, not to make them angry or insult them, trying to be the reasonable ones… if we keep this way they are going to keep going with nobody standing up to them.
I don’t really want to accept it, but you’re probably right.
It’s not whataboutism when OC was the one saying it is a US specific issue
OC said America was full of stupid people. I can’t see how that means that the US would be the only country full of stupid people. Of course there are lots and lots of stupid people elsewhere. Pointing that out in the context of the US election sure sounds like whataboutism to me. My only point is that it does not make things any better just because there are other countries with similar issues. But I see what you mean and think you are right: maybe other countries can learn something from this debacle - I don’t have much hope anymore in that regard but we will see.
But the original comment, calling us all morons, is helpful?
No, of course not. It’s just that even people from other countries are pissed because the US elected Trump a second time. Now we have to deal with his horrible policies again. I personally think the man is a threat for the whole democratic world and because of his horrible positions on climate change and other issues even for the whole world.
And you’re right about all this, but calling us all idiots specifically is not helpful. Millions of Americans are incredibly upset by this. It will be disastrous and there’s not a fucking thing we can do. We voted and it didn’t matter.
I’m sorry if you took my comment that way. I’m really the very last person who wants to lump an entire country together. My point was simply that this election has once again shown that there are significant problems in the US (education, racism, corruption, inequality, etc.) that have allowed Trump to deceive the population yet again. To relativize now by pointing out that things are just as bad or even worse elsewhere in the world only distracts from the real issue in my opinion. Nevertheless, I wish you all the best and very much hope that you can somehow put a stop to Trump’s greed and his terrible ideology.
Way further ahead. Dude literally says he wants to be a dictator.
Only on day 1 haha. Gonna be something interesting to see happen. We should get bingo cards going for day 1
You go ahead and make bingo cards, I’ll be prepping for the civil war.
Thanks for trying to make us feel better, but…
That is simply not true. The extremely varied political landscape of Europe is not comparable to the US…
Wow almost like people are getting sick of being told what to do and how to think by the woke ideology.
Did we huwt youw feewings?
No. You acted as though u had the right to tell me what to do and that i was a bad for how i was born. U judged me by the colour of my skin not the quality if my charecter, and i dont like that.
Sorry you took our opposition to colonialism and white supremacy personally. Maybe you should think about why. That’s clearly not the intention.
Removed by mod
Oh okay, so trannies are your thing… whatever, colonialism and white supremacy were examples. You can say whatever you want, dude, and you clearly have on any number of occasions. Don’t mistake us calling you out for your bullshit for suppression of your free speech. As a self-proclaimed retard, I’m guessing you probably don’t fully understand the issues you’re talking about. I’d be more likely to call you ignorant, which is fine, because ignorance can be cured.
This is an example to good to be true. My comment was deleted but its fine for you to say “trannies” and “retard”. I couldnt prove my point any better if i tried.
Well, I was making fun of your speech patterns but I would understand if the mods want to delete my comment. I think there’s at least some understanding of intent here on lemmy. You clearly either don’t understand gender dysphoria and are proud of your ignorance, or you are just legitimately transphobic. Or maybe a little bit of both. Regardless, getting moderated on an internet forum is not a violation of your free speech either. You said it, I responded to it. We’re having a conversation. Free speech. You don’t get to yell the n word in the lobby of a hotel either.
If that’s what you think equity looks like then I’d say any judgement of your character was likely spot on.
Whats wrong with my understanding of equallity? Please elaborate
Waste of time since your ability to read seems low. Equality ≠ equity
Ohh that wasnt a typo?
Ok then would u agree equallity = equal oppertunity And Equity = equall outcome
?
No. Reductively I’d say equity is a prerequisite for equal opportunity.
All we can see here is the quality of your character. And guess what
Was i talking about u (as in u personaly) or u as in ur ideology and its advocates i interact with irl?
U u u ur.
Learn how to spell.
Ok boomer
Being older than 12 doesn’t make someone a boomer.
If you’re not a queer person of color this comment is so insanely ironic.
Why must i be a queer person of colour? Sounds like ur saying im not allowed to think or say this without being a queer person of colour. Did u just prove my point?
No you troglodyte, I’m saying you’re proving theirs.
So now ur calling me a troglodyte. Why? In an attempt to bully me into complying?
No, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt and assumed you were living under a rock since the alternative is a bit embarrassing.
Can you define exactly what woke ideology is?
Woke ideology is a social and philosophical movement that prioritizes identity politics, cultural Marxism, and social constructivism.
It emphasises:
Basicly
This then meads to:
You can apply all of this to the Trump conservative movement, except that systemic oppression and power imbalances are treated as natural, and thus (at best) not something we need to be concerned about.
Really lets try it:
“The Trump conservative movement is a social and philosophical movement that prioritizes identity politics, cultural Marxism, and social constructivism.” - some guy on lemmy
I mean, Trump conservatism is clearly influenced and informed by post-modernist philosophy. Social constructivism is there in spades. Identity politics predate all of this and have been used by both sides extensively over time. Cultural Marxism… I’m not even sure what it is - sort of an amalgam of critical theory and (((them)))? Okay, you got me on that one.
Lmao did you just make that up yourself?
No i asked my uncensored ai
At least you admit you actually can’t think for yourself
The guys not even American and he’s following Trump like a sheep. How stupid can people be?
I believe its called research. U should try it at some point.
Consulting a semantically aware text predictor is not research, and I’m not even an anti AI guy.
Reads the term “Cultural Marxism”… stops reading.
Hey it’s uh like when you grow a beard that seems like Marx would like it.
I’m pretty sure if Marx had met hipsters then the fucker would’ve been clean shaven pretty quickly.
I’m sure he’d be pissed about most things that go on today. I was just looking for something that “cultural Marxism” could possibly mean.
I’d love Karl’s view on Putin/Russia right now… You’re right trying to find a meaning for that nonsense phrase. I remember doing a web search when I first read it - maybe it meant something. Beyond the reference sites it was all US right wing publications using the term. If only one section of one society is using a phrase that should tell you something about the phrase.
And block the fucker too.
I hear what you’re saying, but… I’m no blocker.
Great. I have no bandwidth to deal with these assholes though.
I guess u cant see this but enjoy ur echo chamber. Its been proven echo chambers make people more extremist.
Why u gonna engage with the ideas or just sit their brooding with a disapproving look?
Imagine I was hungry and you kindly served up a platter of exotic and mysterious food but right in the middle of it there was a festering lump of rotten meat… suddenly I wouldn’t be so hungry. That’s how I feel whenever I encounter that term. There’s no great bogeyman controlling things - it’s just that humanity is slowly moving away from its obsession with invisible sky men telling everyone how to live.
The fuck do some words that describe a sociopolitical concept have to do with rotten meat and a magic sky man?
I’m more than happy to ponder the “sociopolitical concept” of an ongoing culture war that may (or may not) be taking place in western civilisation. The term “Cultural Marxism” is, in and of itself, at best, a conspiracy theory dressed in its Sunday best. I’m sorry the food analogy was lost on you. I was trying to say that those two words turned me off everything else you were saying. The sky man crowd are generally the largest contingent against the “culturally Marxist” shift in society so I thought I’d give them a shout out, for their troubles.
Somehow vague and semi specific at the same time. Just dressed up crybaby bullshit for “I can’t insult minorities with impunity anymore!”
Mkre bad faith insults really?
deleted by creator
Holy fuck, haha.
You are literally defining conservatives everywhere. Do you not fucking get it?
Get what?
And yeah the left and right of the political spectrum as well as the top and bottom are conjoined. Effectively the political spectrum is topologically a torus.
One thing I have noticed is that conservatives everywhere absolutely want to tell everyone else what to do, while crying like little snowflakes about ‘wokeism’ (and none of them can answer what it is).
Projection and all that.
If u could read u would see my definition in responce to the guy who asked. I really wouldnt consider myself a conservative either but since im not with you i must be your enemy.
Just thought I’d drop this little tidbit… I tagged you a while ago “likes the R word a lot”. People are so predictable.
Predictability doesnt make me wrong.
But being a bigot sure as shit does
Welp i havnt done that.
You argued in favor of using the R word after using it. It’s not really debatable.
Im a diagnosed retard. If i cant say retarded then black people cant say the n word. Seems fair to me.
What a good look