don’t take the interest of the people living in Ukraine as the same as the Ukrainian state. Which sovereign? The people, who supposedly is “the sovereign” or the system of power ruling over a liberal nationalist state with very strong repression on (leftist) activists.

You don’t have to agree with the policy of a state to validate their right to self defense… I don’t agree with all of the policy of the Palestinian state, does that mean they deserve to be genocided, or shouldn’t be allowed to defend themselves?

Please. This should be beneath you.

What do you call a person echoing all the talking points of a fascist state? If someone in the 30s was defending lebensraum… I would call them a Nazi.

You’re talking about people and families, not about “Ukraine”.

Ahh, so how do you refer to the Palestinian genocide? Is this delineation from a state from the states people consistent in your ideology, or is it just performative?

I am an anarchist. I would like to separate the power structure from the containing entities (i.e.: I disagree with the common understanding of the purpose of the state).

Lol, you are an anarchist and yet you are defending a fascist state? How exactly is an anarchist failing to analyze the danger of such a hierarchical organization as modern Russia? Since when did anarchist capitulate to fascist? You are an embarrassment to anarchism and need to go read some Murray Bookchin.

The cis-men (and some trans women) were drafted. You’re talking about the power structure again. There may be a lot of voluntaries, but derserters are not tolerated

Again, you are critical of the side defending themselves against a fascist state. You do realize Russia is also drafting people to perpetuate the war? Anarchist have a long history of aligning themselves with governments they don’t agree with to fight fascist, you know because fascism is antithetical to anarchism. What is wrong with you?

A part of them literally are forced. I didn’t say anything about “en masse”.

Ahh, so because the draft exists that means the fascist army that is also drafting people deserve to take what they want? So you know nothing of critical/mutual aid?

Do you think that Russia is the only actor spreading propaganda? O.o It’s even working in Europe: All of Germany (and I think France?) is incredibly hyped for militarization!

Because…? Oh yeah, a fascist nation started the first war in Europe for the first time in decades and has mobilized into a war time economy. Just because anarchist do not believe in certain aspects of the state does not mean they can’t provide critical support in the face of fascism, just as they have done in the past.

probably won’t believe me, but I condemn any imperialism. Not just the one done by the “bad guys”.

But you are making a false equivocation between fascist and liberal imperialism… I’m not a fan of any imperialism either, but I also recognize fascism as the worse form. As an anarchist you too should be able to make the same criticism based on the competing governments hierarchical structure of organization.

If you aren’t recognizing and evaluating based on hierarchy than you aren’t really an anarchist, you’re just a libertarian.

Are you trying to explain to me that war between sovereigns is actually class war?

Lol, are you confusing the definition of sovereignty with sovereign…as in a monarchy? In a democracy sovereignty belongs to the citizens. If we are analyzing hierarchical structures between Russia and Ukraine, which of the citizens posses more sovereignty over their government? The fascist nation led being led unconstitutionaly by a dictator… Or the struggling democracy defending itself from a fascist invasion?

Would that be ok with you? / am not the one in the camp of “international law” and that borders may not be drawn by the sword.

Well, why would you have a problem with it? Your rebuttal with Ukraine is that you aren’t enough of a nationalist to believe in the abstract idea of a nation defending itself…so what would be your problem with NATO doing the same thing Russia is doing to Ukraine?

Seems your argument changes depending on who is the aggressor.

I’d protest, too. Because I don’t like either colonialism. I can condemn both Israel and Hamas, too.

Lol, what a fucking coward. You aren’t an anarchist, you are just a contrarian sitting on the sidelines too afraid to make a stand. You are just a nihilist.

You didn’t specify much on the interest why NATO would do such a thing, so I can’t properly get into your scenario.

Weren’t you the one who didn’t believe that Russia was the aggressor? Again you are a coward and a dishonest one at that.

You’re strawmanning me. I implied that NATO is an imperialist instrument. It’s an association of states to conduct war. Do you even have a proper definition of “Imperialism” that’s not on the level of a Star Wars fan podcast?

No, you are just lying again. You said they weren’t a defensive organization, which is a line straight from the Kremlin.

May I remind you that this discussion started with “no war but class war”. Who profited from these deals? Do you think there is such a thing as a “stable arms economy”?

May I remind you that I started this by condemning American imperialism… I didn’t claim that NATO wasn’t a form of imperialism, it’s just not a fascist one. Again you are falsely equivocating imperialism with fascism.

I think it’s a shame that you feel obliged to steep to these lows.

I’ve provided plenty of examples where your line of reasoning directly conflicts with your claims depending on who we are talking about. Also, claiming to be an anarchist and then tolerating fascism is the last straw. There isn’t a anarchist in modern history who wouldn’t create a common front to fight literal fascist.

If you really are being honest…which I highly doubt. You really need to read some more anarchist literature and maybe some history books. But again, you have too many conflicting ideas to be a reliable narrator.