This should be illegal - eviltoast

This should be illegal, companies should be forced to open-source games (or at least provide the code to people who bought it) if they decide to discontinue it, so people can preserve it on their own.

  • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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    1 year ago

    And in addition to that sentiment, compression from moving or sending a copy of a copy is known to very slowly degrade digital media, so physical is almost always preferred.

    • ipkpjersi@lemmy.ml
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      1 year ago

      As long as you are very serious about your backup system, digital can outlast physical.

      • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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        1 year ago

        Sure, it’s possible, but it’s unlikely. A properly kept laserdisc compared to, for example, a YouTube Video isn’t even a competition. Physical media not exposed to radiation or impact can last decades if not centuries. Don’t even get me started on Vynil.

            • millie@lemmy.film
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              1 year ago

              Literally every seeder is part of that archive. You can look at individual trackers in the microcosm as individual archives and indices, but it’s the culture of piracy that causes the wide scale collection and preservation of media.

              We’re actually at this kind of interesting cross-generational point of guerilla archival where it’s become easier to find certain obscure pieces of media history. I suspect this is in large part due to things like bounties, where suddenly a forgotten VHS of a 35 year old HBO special that aired once or twice could be a step toward a higher rank and greater access to a wider range of media.

              Modern piracy has a strong incentive toward finding lost material that’s no longer readily available. Zero day content is great, but have you seen the RADAR pilot or both seasons of AfterMASH?

              They belong in a museum. Indie would be proud, even if Harrison wouldn’t. Not that I know his perspective on piracy.

              • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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                1 year ago

                Constantly moving compressed files are not the same as a physical media archive, literally the entire point of this discussion.

                • millie@lemmy.film
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                  1 year ago

                  Are you here to repeat that nonsense about file transfer being lossy?

    • lightnegative@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Err, no. Lossless compression is lossless and there are a bunch of techniques to ensure that a copy is bit-for-bit identical to the original

    • Honytawk@lemmy.zip
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      1 year ago

      It is literally the other way around.

      There is no way for digital media to degrade, unless it is the physical media.

      • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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        1 year ago

        Compression and transmission of data causes loss of parity. We lose or flip some 1s and 0s. Over time the effects become very noticeable. The best visual example I can think of are experiments where YouTubers downloaded and reuploaded their own video 100 times, it very quickly degrades. In a more reasonable scenario, near lossless file types and compressions would degrade much more slowly.

        • CeeBee@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          The best visual example I can think of are experiments where YouTubers downloaded and reuploaded their own video 100 times

          This has nothing to do with copying a file. YouTube re-encodes videos whenever they are uploaded.

          A file DOES NOT DEGRADE when it is copied. That is something that happened to VHS and cassette tapes. It does not happen to digital files. You can even verify this by generating a hash of a file, copy it 10,000 times, and generate a new hash and they would be 100% identical.

          • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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            1 year ago

            You should perform that exact experiment with a sufficient number of bits, you’ll be surprised.

            • CeeBee@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              No I won’t be, because I’ve done this before for various reasons, but not a single but was changed.

              Let me put it this way. A computer stores programs and instructions it needs to run in files on a drive. These files contain exact and precise instructions for various components to operate. If even a SINGLE bit is off in just a couple of the OS files, your computer will start throwing constant errors if not just crashing entirely.

              And this isn’t just theory. It’s provable. Cosmic rays have been known to sometimes hit a drive and cause a bit-flip. Or another issue is a drive not being powered on for a long time causing bit-rot

              At this point I’m starting to think you’re a troll. There’s no way someone believes what you’re saying.

              Edit: autocorrect

              • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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                1 year ago

                I’m going to stop responding to you few left in this thread because I don’t think you’re trolls, I know you are.

                • CeeBee@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  Then you’re not a troll, just completely deluded and frankly stupid. You’ve been getting so many genuine responses trying to help you learn, but you keep digging in your heels and doubling down on being confidently wrong.

                  Believe whatever you want, just keep it to yourself.

                  • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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                    1 year ago

                    They want to “help me learn” that a form of media storage invented and refined within a couple of decades will outlast all other forms, because they’ve deluded themselves that the things they rely on are perfect and that failure is impossible.

        • pikmeir@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          You’re referring to a video codec degrading as it keeps rendering the video again, not just copying and pasting the bits. There is no degradation from copying and pasting a file as-is.

          • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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            1 year ago

            No, I am not referring to that. YouTubers have the option to download their own videos. Not steal it with a video downloading tool.

              • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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                1 year ago

                And when you download the processed video and reupload it, it’s a 1 to 1 conversion of the same video codec, and every generation it gets worse. That example is a low hanging fruit, but the concept applies to everything.

                • pikmeir@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  No, this is because YouTube compresses every file before distributing it. This happens even when downloading on the creator side.

                  • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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                    1 year ago

                    Literally every file distribution method compresses the media first. A better argument was that YouTube re-encodes the video during the re-upload with a particularly lossy method to save on bandwidth and server space.

                • bitwolf@lemmy.one
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                  1 year ago

                  That 1:1 conversion through the same codec is very likely lossy. However that’s not a straight file copy which is what you originally said causes degradation.

                  • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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                    1 year ago

                    You really jumped in here to tell me exactly the contents of a comment I made just below it in the thread, as if I didn’t already know it.

    • Flax@feddit.uk
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      1 year ago

      Games don’t get lossy compressed when sent. They aren’t films or photographs.

      • doctorcrimson@lemmy.today
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        1 year ago

        If you use most digital formats for media and compress them with something like .7z or Winrar, then it might take years or decades to noticeable degrade, but it is still a matter of when not if.

        • CeeBee@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Holy crap. File compression is not the same thing as lossy media compression.

          File compression uses mathematical algorithms to create definable outcomes. Meaning it doesn’t matter how much you compress/uncompress a file, it will always be exactly the same.

          5 X 2 will always give you 10 and 10 ÷ 2 will always give you 5.