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Cake day: July 6th, 2023

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  • 💪 Someone is getting it.

    Well, closer linguistically. I have watched a video of three speakers of these languages saying (relatively) basic sentences, leaving the other two to guess what it means. The Finnish and Estonian speakers were kind of on the same frequency. The Hungarian was clueless about the other two, and vice versa.





  • Okay but even as a native hungarian i have to say “sz” is just insane. Polish is so much more logical with “s” making the non-shushing sound and “sz” making the shushing sound.

    Totally agreed. Like, also, everything else that you mentioned, but especially this. I really don’t get where they got the idea from, since every (most?) language around has it the other way around, including Latin and German (and their derivatives like romance languages and such). Maybe Turkish and/or Romanian that I can think of, but AFAIK even they put diacritics on their ‘s’ when referring to the ‘sh’ sound (I don’t speak any of those, though, so I might be horribly wrong).
    It’s especially annoying because most Western European speakers are more used to the Polish sz-s system (which makes more sense), completely butchering words like Szoboszlai (I’m playing E-Football and the commentator pronounces his name like three different wrong ways, about never right).

    I had a relatively old teacher ~30 years ago that said ‘j’ and ‘ly’ are pronounced slightly differently, giving two examples, and I couldn’t hear any difference : ).

    I used to go to uni in Szeged so it was quite eye-opening reading about the weird 'e’s. So if I got that right, that’s the reason they say stuff with ‘ö’ instead of ‘e’ in certain cases (because it’s not exactly ‘ö’, but that’s the closest regular letter we’ve got)?

    And yeah, ‘bicikli’ is actually pronounced more like ‘bicigli’ (or not? Could be regional) and stuff, but what I meant by ‘consistent’ is that almost always if you see something spelled a certain way you can expect it to sound that certain way, without bullshit silent letters and completely different consonants or vowels. Not in terms of phonemes but actual letters.

    And yeah, ‘bicikli’ is actually pronounced more like ‘bicigli’
    (I’m still salty about ‘bicikli’ keeping the ‘k’ but the short for ‘lakodalom’ is ‘lagzi’ and not ‘lakzi’)


  • True, I might have phrased it wrong. The way we (I?) pronounce that ‘c’ the tongue position is slightly different from ‘t’ (less of the very tip of it, a tad bit further to the back, close to the tip), hence I thought it deserves the status of a separate sound instead of a transition between the two. Mind you I’m not a linguist and it may be completely bonkers from an actual expert’s perspective.



  • While it’s true from an English speaker’s perspective, to a non-native whose alphabet contains the ‘ts’ sound as a separate letter: there’s no ‘t’ sound in our ‘ts’ sound (which is just the letter ‘c’ for us - boring details in the spoiler section), since it’s not a series of ‘t’ and ‘s’, but one consistent sound on its own, deserving its own letter.

    So we would naturally say the ‘ts’ in tsunami doesn’t have a ‘t’ or an ‘s’ (or any silent letter) in it.

    spoiler

    The 3 c’s in ‘pacific ocean’ are all pronounced differently. We don’t have that madness. Spelling to pronunciation is consistent. The first ‘c’ is just an ‘s’ sound, so we just use our letter for the ‘s’ sound. Which is ‘sz’. It might look weird, but only because the letter ‘s’ is preserved for the ‘sh’ sound. Unusual, but consistent. The middle ‘c’ is pronounced ‘k’. We just use ‘k’ when it sounds like ‘k’. So what do we use ‘c’ for? The ‘ts’ sound. Consistently. ‘tsunami’ is spelled ‘cunami’ here.

    This is why it sounded so weird when as a kid I watched an American film and they looked at a written word and went “How do you pronounce it?”. WTF mate, it’s written right there!