Are you an expert in psychiatric diagnosis? Neither am I, but I have spent enough years with loved ones trying to navigate the so called mental health system or industry. Scratch a little on the surface of psychiatry and you find not science, but snake-oil, pseudo science and lots of abuse.
There is an enormous gap between a diagnosis made by a medical doctor based on medical exams, and a diagnosis made by a so called mental health professional based on talking to you for ca. 55 min. Or make it even 2 x 55min. The professional might, based on their culture or experience, diagnose you with Borderline disorder (a popular option for teenage girls), Bipolar disease (a favourite for the male midlife crisis), general anxiety and/or chronic fatigue and/or chronic pain (for women who have learned they have to function to have value, hear dearie take another pill!) or a range of other things currently in fashion or in fashion when the person learned their trade … nobody sits out there in their psychiatric practice and actually measures people’s brain functions, like with real science (although there seems to be evidence that in the case of ASD/ADHD one actually could).
I distrust health and especially mental health institutions because I haven’t gotten the support from them they claim they offer. Their medications have consistently made my loved ones and me worse. Their advice was either non-existent or trivial (I could have googled it). Their structures were all built to induce the symptoms they claim to cure (ever saw a bunch of overworked doctors and nurses smoke in the hospital entrance? Ever looked at what’s inside of a hospital vending machine? How a psychiatric patient spends their day?
(Unless you have money to spend on more agreeable mental health surroundings, like you could send your socially awkward child to a nice kind of institution.) /s
As I said there is lots to find wrong with all our institutions and I understand where it comes from, but does that mean we completely disregard everything now throw the baby out with the bath water? Should you now be able to prescribe medications for yourself now too? Because you have seen the institutional problems does that make you an expert in their field? I get being able to see problems that doesn’t take a degree or training it still doesn’t make you personally an expert (and don’t confused when I say you, I also mean me and everyone else that doesn’t work in that field) You could come to my work and see how poorly it’s run but that doesn’t mean you are gonna be able to jump on a locomotive and operate it.
Yes you personally have experienced the gaps in the medical field how about tons of other people who haven’t, every job on this planet has people that are shit at doing the job they are in, that doesn’t mean the job is no longer viable on the whole, if you have bad experiences with doctors you try elsewhere if it’s possible and realistic obviously
You still don’t get it. It’s not about experts in a scientific field. It’s about ‘experts’ who literally made up the entire field out of mostly nothing. Psychiatry is not a science.
There’s more hard science in driving a locomotive than diagnosing a person with a made up mental condition.
I mean, technically you’re correct. Psychiatry isn’t a science, because Psychiatrists are just Psychologists that can prescribe medicine.
Psychology is a soft science, which means that yes it is constantly subject to change.
That being said, if you think they’re made up conditions then why are you still adhering to their terminology? Or are you trying to say that psychiatrists will wrongfully diagnose someone for the sake of selling drugs? Because those two things are very different and you’ve done nothing to show that you’re aware.
Made-up conditions or drug-selling motive? Why can’t it be both? If I described my inner experience in my own words you might not understand me. Read again: I don’t think autism is made up. I don’t think ADHD is made-up. But I don’t like the ‘disorder’ connotation of those terms. I’m not disordered, I function differently.
I think a lot of other conditions are made up, or rather they are just descriptions of symptoms with the word ‘disorder’ attached to it. Recently the whole idea of the brain chemical imbalance as cause of depression has been questioned, but Psychiatrists keep medicating people all the same. Probably most don’t want to sell drugs, they just try to help people the best they know and both pharma and academia tell them that’s the way. But really, we have no idea what causes autism, or ADHD, or depression. The treatments offered are experimental at best and have often shown to be harmful in the long term. Between a stranger who doesn’t know me and doesn’t know very much, and myself who knows me and doesn’t know very much - who should I trust?
I have always said that seeing Psychiatrists is a mistake, and that if you want real help you should seek a psychologist first. However, like with cases of people who have bi-polar disorder, (which absolutely is real, you wouldn’t even think to claim otherwise if you’d experienced someone on a manic high) they need the drugs because otherwise they will destroy themselves.
I gave up on trying to seek help from those types a long time ago, mainly because I decided that I couldn’t find answers from people who couldn’t even tell that I was lying.
However I also stopped using their words on myself. If you conflate “self diagnosis” with “soul searching” then yes self diagnosis is ok.
Not everyone does. Some people see it as an easy ticket to manipulate others. As far as who to trust is concerned, regarding doctors, the line for me has always been “do they try to get me to take drugs?”.
If yes, fuck off, if no: I’ll probably find another reason to stop seeing them.
Okay well here’s where I have no idea what you are going on about then, if that’s how you see them then why did you go to them for mental health advice and why did you take medications they prescribed? Makes zero sense
I had to look up sealioning since I had no idea what it meant, no I’m not, and since you decided to frame your question that way maybe you just need a thicker skin, you engaged me in the convo, not everyone is going to automatically agree with you in life
So you personally had a bad run in and you did believe in them but no longer do… okay I guess you are right then may as well invalidate the entire profession cuz schmorpel got bad service… that is some flat earth type reasoning
Are you an expert in psychiatric diagnosis? Neither am I, but I have spent enough years with loved ones trying to navigate the so called mental health system or industry. Scratch a little on the surface of psychiatry and you find not science, but snake-oil, pseudo science and lots of abuse.
There is an enormous gap between a diagnosis made by a medical doctor based on medical exams, and a diagnosis made by a so called mental health professional based on talking to you for ca. 55 min. Or make it even 2 x 55min. The professional might, based on their culture or experience, diagnose you with Borderline disorder (a popular option for teenage girls), Bipolar disease (a favourite for the male midlife crisis), general anxiety and/or chronic fatigue and/or chronic pain (for women who have learned they have to function to have value, hear dearie take another pill!) or a range of other things currently in fashion or in fashion when the person learned their trade … nobody sits out there in their psychiatric practice and actually measures people’s brain functions, like with real science (although there seems to be evidence that in the case of ASD/ADHD one actually could).
I distrust health and especially mental health institutions because I haven’t gotten the support from them they claim they offer. Their medications have consistently made my loved ones and me worse. Their advice was either non-existent or trivial (I could have googled it). Their structures were all built to induce the symptoms they claim to cure (ever saw a bunch of overworked doctors and nurses smoke in the hospital entrance? Ever looked at what’s inside of a hospital vending machine? How a psychiatric patient spends their day?
(Unless you have money to spend on more agreeable mental health surroundings, like you could send your socially awkward child to a nice kind of institution.) /s
Just picking out two of your arguments:
A psychiatrist is a medical doctor.
During my assessment for ADHD an EEG was administered and the assessment for autism in my country includes on as well.
As I said there is lots to find wrong with all our institutions and I understand where it comes from, but does that mean we completely disregard everything now throw the baby out with the bath water? Should you now be able to prescribe medications for yourself now too? Because you have seen the institutional problems does that make you an expert in their field? I get being able to see problems that doesn’t take a degree or training it still doesn’t make you personally an expert (and don’t confused when I say you, I also mean me and everyone else that doesn’t work in that field) You could come to my work and see how poorly it’s run but that doesn’t mean you are gonna be able to jump on a locomotive and operate it.
Yes you personally have experienced the gaps in the medical field how about tons of other people who haven’t, every job on this planet has people that are shit at doing the job they are in, that doesn’t mean the job is no longer viable on the whole, if you have bad experiences with doctors you try elsewhere if it’s possible and realistic obviously
You still don’t get it. It’s not about experts in a scientific field. It’s about ‘experts’ who literally made up the entire field out of mostly nothing. Psychiatry is not a science.
There’s more hard science in driving a locomotive than diagnosing a person with a made up mental condition.
I mean, technically you’re correct. Psychiatry isn’t a science, because Psychiatrists are just Psychologists that can prescribe medicine.
Psychology is a soft science, which means that yes it is constantly subject to change.
That being said, if you think they’re made up conditions then why are you still adhering to their terminology? Or are you trying to say that psychiatrists will wrongfully diagnose someone for the sake of selling drugs? Because those two things are very different and you’ve done nothing to show that you’re aware.
Made-up conditions or drug-selling motive? Why can’t it be both? If I described my inner experience in my own words you might not understand me. Read again: I don’t think autism is made up. I don’t think ADHD is made-up. But I don’t like the ‘disorder’ connotation of those terms. I’m not disordered, I function differently.
I think a lot of other conditions are made up, or rather they are just descriptions of symptoms with the word ‘disorder’ attached to it. Recently the whole idea of the brain chemical imbalance as cause of depression has been questioned, but Psychiatrists keep medicating people all the same. Probably most don’t want to sell drugs, they just try to help people the best they know and both pharma and academia tell them that’s the way. But really, we have no idea what causes autism, or ADHD, or depression. The treatments offered are experimental at best and have often shown to be harmful in the long term. Between a stranger who doesn’t know me and doesn’t know very much, and myself who knows me and doesn’t know very much - who should I trust?
I have always said that seeing Psychiatrists is a mistake, and that if you want real help you should seek a psychologist first. However, like with cases of people who have bi-polar disorder, (which absolutely is real, you wouldn’t even think to claim otherwise if you’d experienced someone on a manic high) they need the drugs because otherwise they will destroy themselves.
I gave up on trying to seek help from those types a long time ago, mainly because I decided that I couldn’t find answers from people who couldn’t even tell that I was lying.
However I also stopped using their words on myself. If you conflate “self diagnosis” with “soul searching” then yes self diagnosis is ok.
Not everyone does. Some people see it as an easy ticket to manipulate others. As far as who to trust is concerned, regarding doctors, the line for me has always been “do they try to get me to take drugs?”.
If yes, fuck off, if no: I’ll probably find another reason to stop seeing them.
Okay well here’s where I have no idea what you are going on about then, if that’s how you see them then why did you go to them for mental health advice and why did you take medications they prescribed? Makes zero sense
I see them like this after experiencing their service. Are you sealioning or was that a real question?
I had to look up sealioning since I had no idea what it meant, no I’m not, and since you decided to frame your question that way maybe you just need a thicker skin, you engaged me in the convo, not everyone is going to automatically agree with you in life
So you personally had a bad run in and you did believe in them but no longer do… okay I guess you are right then may as well invalidate the entire profession cuz schmorpel got bad service… that is some flat earth type reasoning