- cross-posted to:
- games@hexbear.net
- cross-posted to:
- games@hexbear.net
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Wait, the mod removed the option to set a gender in the character editor? Why don’t these people just make a male character and be done with it?
Because it’s not actually about the pronouns. These people aren’t actually angry about pronouns.
They’re angry about trans and non-binary people. They’re angry that people are growing to accept these people, who they do not think should be accepted. They are angry that a group they don’t think is normal, is being accepted as normal.
I don’t think it’s even about that, they’re angry because the want to be angry. The why doesn’t matter, if the current right wing outrage du-jour had been… I dunno, left handed people rather than trans people, you’d see all the same people working themselves into a screaming tantrum if a game or movie had a left handed person in it.
For sure. And when there’s not enough people focused on trans people they’ll shift their focus to some other marginalized group to harass.
These limp dicked losers have literally nothing better to do but jerk each other off in their seedy racist forums and message boards.
Oh no, it’s very much hatred. The same hatred they had for black or gay people.
Who the hell are you to say that I hate black and gay people? You’re overgeneralizing a group, how much different are you in this case? Stop with that man, this is why we can’t have actual debates.
The problem is you want to debate.
There’s no debate. No one has to tolerate your intolerance.
Gay people exist. Trans people exist. Fin.
Stereotyping people and overgeneralizing things without actually debating your point is ridiculous. Grow up man.
And the “replaced white people”. And the female leaders. If someone wants a taste, go through the Steam forums for the game. It’s a complete deranged mess.
Steam forums are the absolute bottom of the barrel for game discussion, maybe tied with 4chan.
Let’s roll it back a bit. There’s a bit of a difference between “accepted” and “tolerated”. For the most part, the trans community is merely tolerated by the majority of the country.
I don’t know what the point of your comment is.
Trans and non-binary people are becoming more accepted as normal over time. The people screaming about pronouns don’t actually care about pronouns, they oppose that gradually growing acceptance.
It’s not “about trans and non-binary people,” it’s about the injection of identity politics into video games. The removal of the mod shows that activist fiat is necessary to present the illusion that people buy into gender ideology.
The existence of trans and nonbinary people is not an injection of identity politics into video games. The fact that they exist and a video game is acknowledging their existence is not political.
No no no, you have to break their brains.
Ahem:
White people in a video game is political. Statistically, the default is Han.
Wow 2+2 is 4 in this video game??? Didn’t know it’s going so WOKE
You just but I wouldn’t be surprised if that happened.
Conservatives have a long running feud with the sciences.
I thought 2+2=4 was anti-woke? Wasn’t there a whole weird Twitter drama thing a couple of years ago where 2+2=4 was considered the racist side?
did a bot write this? what are you even trying to say?
Are you one of those people that thinks anything that’s not straight cis white is “identify politics”? That anything that isn’t your world view is “political”? If so, please go fuck yourself. If not, I have no idea what you’re on about.
Not a bot; just a bigot. If you scroll to the very bottom, a good 30% of the total comments are this guy digging a hole trying to prove it’s “woke” society that’s the problem and not him.
That’s legitimately just sad. What a pathetic individual.
It got worse:
The only thing left to fight for is the right to indoctrinate very young school children into gender ideology and show them, graphically, how to be gay.
Either a troll, or too far gone to help.
Teaching children how to be gay, sure.
Hey, Children. If you like somebody and they like you back, don’t worry about which gender you think you belong to.
People can love people no matter if they are the same gender or not.
Pronouns, gender, genitals, etc. in player-character customization are just yet another option for someone to tailor their gameplay to whatever experience they want.
The only identity politics comes from the people politicizing it.
“Identity politics” always seems to mean “I am upset that different people exist.”
This is a nothing option in a video game. Nobody’s rubbing your nose in it. It doesn’t affect you, at all, but it’s a neat little extra for other people. Do you give a shit about other people? Or does the mere possibility of anyone distinct from you, the protagonist of reality, fill you with emotions you can’t handle? There’s no third option, here. It’s a checkbox for how NPCs choose voice lines, in exactly the same way they’ve done for decades. It’s just separate now.
But of course one glance at your profile shows you’re an unapologetic bigot, and what you mean by “gEnDeR iDeOlOgY” is exactly what every other diet Nazi means by it: you hate queer people, and you want it to be their fault.
Out.
Yeah, having that “he/she/they” toggle and calling sex “body type 1 and 2” instead of male/female sure is political. You know when it became political? When people saw them and went “REEEEEEEEEEEEE” because they’re bigoted dumbfucks.
,“Identity politics” in this case meaning “trans and non-binary people exist and are trans or non-binary respectively”.
The removal of the mod shows that activist fiat is necessary to present the illusion that people buy into gender ideology
Bullcrap. It shows nothing of the sort. It shows nothing more than that NexusMods doesn’t feel like hosting assholes.
It’s only politics because people go out of their way to oppress them. There’s nothing to be political about if people are allowed to be who they are.
The fact that you unironically used the term 'gender ideology ’ proves that you are, in fact, a bigoted little shit.
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They need to force their views on others. If anyone believes what they believe, then they are suddenly just like everyone else instead of the bigot they know they are deep down
They aren’t really forcing their views on anyone though, they’re just jacking themselves off. No nonconforming person is going to download this and inflict it on themselves, and they have no reason to use it themselves unless they’re just really closeted and lack the will to not express their own nonconformity. It can literally only exist to rile people up who sought out the mod specifically, which includes only them.
If they weren’t trying to force their views on others they’d just make their character a guy and move on. They go through the trouble of coding this mod to push their agenda on others.
What I’m trying to say though is that most of them just do make their character a guy and move on. They don’t need the mod and the people who they think do need it aren’t going to install it. It’s not just a transparent attempt to ignite culture war arguments online, but it’s a stupid and ineffective one.
The point of the mod is not to change something in game, its to appear in the list of mods and remind some people that they are hated and bigots will never stop hating them.
Its a weird “I was here, and I hated x people”.
I have trouble imagining enough people wanting to download a mod to do this to get it to appear on anything but the most recent releases list, and to only be on that list long enough for some other mods to get released.
Well, the type of person that would do this wouldnt be opposed to spoofing the number as well. And they can just keep reuploading the mod so it’s always appearing in the list.
The point is, their ineffective methods still worked a little. Ruining someone’s day, hour or even minute is validation enough
Apparently nexus mods has some sort of ad sharing with mod makers. Could be a grift. Grift is popular among right wingers, possibly because they are on a fundamental level stupid.
Some grifter makes an anti “woke” mod that probably took 5 minutes. A bunch of stupid chuds download it to pwn the libs. Grifter makes money. Chuds feel good about their shitty lives.
How does installing a mod on a single player game force views on anyone?
Insisting that Nexus Mods should host this bigoted mod is the losers who walk in fear of “woke culture” trying to enforce their bigoted views on the rest of the world. The assholes are still free to install that mod but Nexus Mods is just as free to not host that trash.
I can think of one: a parent who installs this before letting their child play it to enforce their culture of hatred within their house.
The crazy thing is how hysterical they’re being over something you can fail to even notice is there. It gave me male pronouns as I choose the male body type, and the button prompt to change it is hidden way down at the bottom of the screen. It’s literally on screen for a few seconds and then never mentioned again in a game with hundreds of hours gameplay.
Yeah, I’d see reaction videos before I played, and I honestly couldn’t find how to change my pronouns for a good 30 seconds.
God, Bethesda sucks at UI.
Yeah, it took me ages to realise the prompt was at the bottom of the screen, I didn’t even want to change them, I was just wondering why it set off such a wobbler with the bald bloke.
Then they couldn’t do their performative outrage, which is all they have.
Because REEEEEEEEE
Because they’re little fucking babies.
Looking throughout history, aalways have been
What difference does it make that they don’t?
Does it matter? I have a mod to improve blood splatter, does murder meet your approval?
If someone made a “killing Jews” mod it wouldn’t be allowed either.
Nazis aren’t welcome.
To confused people exploring from all Communities trying to understand what the hell is going on:
- Bethesda is a game studio who does a decent job of giving people choice to do/be whatever they want in their games. Out of the box they included the option to choose your pronouns in a new game called “Starfield”.
- They also make it possible to modify their games to make very drastic changes to the player experience.
- Nexus is a site that hosts thousands of mods to all sorts of games. People make mods, upload them to Nexus and players download them.
- Someone made a mod to remove the option to choose pronouns from Starfield.
- Nexus decided they don’t want to host this mod. It’s hurtful to people and goes against their values of inclusivity.
That’s about it. Most of the people whinging about censorship don’t even play the game. They’re just here to whinge about how the world is moving on from old bigoted ways and they want to stay in the past and be jerks to people for merely existing. If they actually cared, they’d just download the mod from some other site. The mod itself is probably not much bigger than this reply.
Moderation exists to identify and exclude people who are being absolute cocks.
You don’t need any grand philosophical statement about values. You don’t need to defend the paradox of tolerance against absolutist demands for unrestricted expression. It’s perfectly fine to say: you were doing some diet Nazi shit, that’s awful, fuck off.
This is all fine and well, but am I the only one a bit concerned about how NexusMods is practically a monopoly in the modding scene? Why does literally every modder have to use a rate-limiting host as a platform, especially when Github exists?
Well, for one thing, Nexus gives modders a share of ad revenue. Under a different name, I have a mod that’s a backend requirement for a big, popular mod, and that nets me a reliable few bucks a month.
That said, a good portion of the modding community also exists on Gamebanana. If you want BotW, ToTK or Source engine mods, GB is the go-to.
Wait I have a stupid subscription to nexus and idk why I haven’t canceled it (used it for one month for some mod back in the day). I use nexus for all mods. Should I keep my sub then because all I care about is modders getting something.
I bought lifetime premium years ago when it was still an option and have never once regretted it.
The lifetime access was such a good investment. I missed a lot of other lifetime subscriptions, and am glad I get such great download speed.
Well, if you’re paying for premium, you’re still part of the site’s profit, part of which goes to the mods you use, so either way shouldn’t matter.
I mean, github does exist. It looks like people just prefer platforms with a pre-existing community.
Mods uploaded to github does really suck for discoverability though. There’s the roguelike Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead. The modding scene exists entirely on Github and you’d basically never find them unless you go searching for mods on their Discord channel.
Steam workshop exists as well, for games that support it.
That’s even worse though. Plenty of games (e.g. Stellaris and RimWorld) are also available on platforms like GOG or, ugh, Epic. But if you want to use mods and you bought the game on any platform other than Steam it’s fuck you.
Even if you buy Terraria off of steam, you can use steam mods. Sounds like a per-game problem, rather than a steam problem.
I know it is, developers can block downloads unless the user is signed into a Steam account that owns the game. But as an end-user that’s distinction without difference.
https://steamworkshopdownloader.io/ never gotten this to work myself but I put the least amount of effort in as possible. There may be others as well but I remember when I did my research a couple years ago that it was a real trudge and almost not worth it.
I know there are workarounds, but this is true. There are very little games I buy (at least directly) through steam nowadays, because I didn’t like what it became after the Greenlight/Direct debacle and I didn’t want my library to be that dependent of them anymore.
I have playnite as a unified game library launcher (with GoG, itch.io, humble, Ubi, EA, even Amazon Prime and freaking EGS just for the free games), so where I get my games from doesn’t matter much for me now.
But workshop integration is basically the only thing that makes me want a Steam copy for a game.
Though among the games in that case, there were Rimworld and Dwarf Fortress, and for both if you get a copy directly from the developers, you get DRM-free and a Steam key. So, that’s what I did.
There’s a couple issues with it. I mean, it’s simple for games where you’re not using a bunch of mods, but at some point it just becomes excessive. Not to mention that when a mod updates, the mod will automatically update breaking your game sometimes, or when you’re trying to play a game, a mod just doesn’t update causing it to break the game that way too. There’s just a lack of control that’s often necessary when modding.
For beatsaber (which doesn’t use steam workshop), the there’s no steam integration and its a pain to deal with.
For terraria (which uses steam workshop), the modloader is smart enough to know which mods don’t work with the current version of the game and disables them and steam lets you easily change which version of the game you have by using the “beta” options. Only time I’ve had issues with updates breaking things since 1.4 release was during beta-builds of 1.4 tmodloader (and those were generally easily fixed by going to the discord and finding the file to fix it). Since then, no needing to find files and paste them over the existing files, etc. No trying to install one mod at a time out of a dozen or two until you find which one breaks it and redoing the whole process over again. Pretty sure it also just uses the version of mods that support the game version you have, deals with dependencies automatically, etc… The modloader will also direct you to things like the non-steam pages for mods (sometimes forum posts, sometimes discord, etc).
I don’t think the steam integration is needed for such a seamless mod experience, but its certainly compatible with it. And terraria is an outlier because the game devs encourage mods and has a huge and dedicated community. For smaller games with devs that don’t like mods, simply trying to keeping things working may take so much work, so that time that making a good integrated user experience is probably difficult.
Let’s be real here though, Terraria is an unfair comparison considering it’s modloader is integrated into the game itself and holds significantly greater support than most other mods with Steam Workshop support. (Oh and that the modloader is basically a community made mod manager anyways and is akin to using the community mod managers for the games mentioned below)
Stellaris, Rimworld, Divinity: Original Sin 2, Total War: Warhammer 3, Binding of Isaac, Dwarf Fortress, Space Engineers, Cities: Skylines, all of these very popular games with massive modding support are still plagued by the issues I mentioned above. And you know what? It has the issues you mentioned as well. Did you subscribe to an outdated mod? Oh, well, good luck figuring out which one that is. Forgot to download a dependency? Crash. Did a mod update and Steam just didn’t update the mod? Figure out what mod that was and unsubscribe to it and subscribe to it again. Did a mod just update and Steam updated the mod, even though the update breaks save compatibility? Well, unless the mod author uploaded the older version of the mod, good luck trying to have fun.
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I don’t think that term really applies here. It’s not like the barrier to entry for a webservice hosting game modification data is all that high. It’s very different from the railway, waterworks and power grid markets.
Also there are at least the competitors Loverslab, Curseforge, ModMD and Modrinth from the top of my head.
Network effect creates barriers to new competitors, regardless of quality. Either for the upstarts or the leaders. See: Twitter. Once some choice is the default, anything else faces an uphill battle.
Adoption is a feature you can’t design.
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Does any one of those integrate with Mod Organizer or do I have to download the mod (often also with an annoying wait time) and then point Mod Organizer to it. Do they have an API that enables “a new version is out” notifications, or do I have to hunt everything down manually.
It really wouldn’t be that hard, but none of them cares. Nexus kinda has itself positioned well there as they would not have to support any third-party API endpoints in Vortex, but Vortex isn’t even the popular choice for many games.
I remember using ModDB back then, I’m shocked that they have never updated their site since then
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That went so well until your proposed alternative was Microsoft.
At least github is easier than the shit that is nexusmods
Also there are alternatives
Gitlab… sourceforge…
Ive downloaded a lot of mods from sourceforge over the years
Ive downloaded a lot of mods from sourceforge over the years
Your poor malware ridden computer….
Yeah, but all of it’s for Windows XP.
I know what Microsoft’s general reputation is, but it’s undeniable that GitHub has only seen improvements since Microsoft acquired it.
since Microsoft acquired it.
Embrace
Extend
Estinquish
They have not changed.
That only makes sense if Microsoft had a GotHub competitor lol. I think it was more about getting that juicy data and making copilot.
Yeah, an alternative using git would be good probably, but maybe don’t use github. Preferably though, it’d be agnostic and just target some git repo anywhere. It’d pull from a description file for the page to ensure a uniform appearance preferably, and it’d show and manage versions from some uniformly named folder on the repo.
There’s also steam workshop. Neither are shining examples of a free modding community. I think nexus mods starting out better and slowly enshittified but I don’t know the extent of it.
Nexus hasn’t changed much over the years. They just make a new mod tool every few years it feels like lol.
I think it’s just the internet being the internet. Or at least how it’s been for awhile. There are big sites that a lot of people crowd to and that becomes the default. Like auctioning things off online. Ebay. That was where everyone went to. Need to order a few different things online? Amazon. Are there other online stores? Plenty. But Amazon is seen as cheap and convenient.
Nexus mods is just the popular site, but the moders have other options.
We don’t. My ultrawide mods get thousands of downloads and I haven’t uploaded a single one to Nexus.
There’s also the Thunder store!
That’s kinda like saying PlanetMinecraft monopolized sharing world’s, isn’t it?
There’s stuff like Curseforge, but it’s only for some games, mostly Minecraft. The problem, if someone considers it a problem, is really that communities for games generally centralize around one site for their mods for the most part, and Nexus has garnered a lot of trust and therefore has more pull/inertia for communities working those things out.
As for Github, I believe the vast majority of mods have Github pages, but Github itself doesn’t really have a UI suited for mod downloaders, and no real incentive to implement one. So sites like Nexus and Curseforge are still a necessity.
https://www.curseforge.com/starfield
Starfield mods (a few) on Curseforge currently
Nice! Personally I don’t have any particular issue with Nexus, but it’s always nice to see diversity. Monopolies are pretty much never good for end users.
My only issue with Nexus is that I have to create a login to download mods there. I don’t want to sign in to websites just to DL something. Curseforge is good for Minecraft mods and doesn’t hassle me with a login prompt
That’s fair.
I was really hoping thunderstore and mod.io would take off more since they seem more platform-agnostic and FOSS-like with their integration with git and versioning (and for some games they have), but people just prefer convenience of nexusmods and steam workshop unfortunately. They just have a bigger community and better discoverability in the end
They have integration with Ready Or Not iirc. MSFS also has far more mods on Flightsim.TO than on Nexus.
I believe modrinth will be expanding to be more than Minecraft mods iirc.
R2Modman and thunderstore.io has grown it’s catalogue quite a bit as of late, but it’s mostly (don’t know if it’s entirely or not) unity games. It’s my favorite modding platform with features that make sharing modlists for multiplayer a breeze.
Their rate-limiting isn’t bad at all, their integration into everything is excellent, and for games without much of a community Vortex is often the only mod manager. Their API isn’t closed down, so Mod Organiser can integrate with Nexus just as well, and they probably would also do it with other mod sites if those ever bothered to set up a version check etc. API. They have an excellent search function.
In short: They provide a good service. Like the most annoying part about Nexus as a freeloader is the five or what seconds wait before your mod manager picks up the download.
And, no, their rate limiting really isn’t bad. 1.5MB/s for people with adblock, 3MB/s for people without. How often do you download gigabytes worth of mods it’s not like they’re bullying you into a subscription.
Nexus has the lions share, but only for some games, I had a premium subscription but still found for like half the games I mod that nexus either didn’t have a modpage for them or that most modders for that game used other sites to host their mods
In Curseforge we trust
Not really sure curseforge is better. Its another of those sites with an sketchy bloaty overwolf launcher that makes you jump through hoops to load mods onto a server.
It’s concerningly hard to avoid overwolf in modding
I hope that was snarky because CF has really gone downhill.
It’s like I didn’t think it could get worse but it just kept getting worse and worse lol.
Yeah no question Curseforge ain’t great and if you want to get a modpack as opposed to a singular mod you get kind of screwed by the launcher.
Thing is, the alternatives tend to suck more. Plus my point was that Nexus ain’t alone.
Considering their policy doesn’t allow for other stuff like this, yeah I am not surprised.
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Reminds me of the time when a Spiderman mod removed the VERY few instances of a pride flag in a recreation of NEW YORK CITY and a Skyrim mod that removed any potential gay romances that only occur when wearing a very specific amulet (including a single dead skeleton couple off the beaten path.)
Those got booted as well cause…come on now. Its blatantly targeting a group of people about their sexuality and gender who have BARELY any presence to begin with in these games.
Starfield is even more egregious as its LITERALLY just a menu option and the rare use in dialogue…
Really pathetic and sad people would even feel the need to make them to begin with. Let alone feel the need to upload them to a platform.
I swear to god, every time i hear about conservatives getting upset about gay and trans rights I’m more convinced it’s projection. They want to have the freedom to follow their own preferences but have been taught by someone in their family and/or society that certain preferences are completely unacceptable. Rather than go against the grain, they lean into the hate side of it. “If i can’t have that, you sure as hell can’t–and if you do, you’re gonna pay dearly” seems to be the philosophy. All this because they want to explore their sexuality but they decided the social price is too much. Not allowed to have what they crave, now they just scorn those that are brave enough to face the storm they themselves avoided…or they just hate people having freedom. Probably both.
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Does anyone even install these mods or do they just exist for people to get outraged at?
I would imagine a bare handful of people install them.
There’s some number of people who are so angry and stupid that the mere sight of something like an option to choose pronouns fills them with blind, seething rage, so for them, mods like this are essentially QOL improvements.
More’s the pity…
option to choose pronouns fills them with blind, seething rage
Yeah I was there when BATTLETECH (still dunno why its name has to be so LOUD :P ) launched. Every hatefool was raging about it, apropos of anything or nothing. Try to talk about any part of it and it’s “OH YOU MEAN FUCKING PRONOUNWARRIOR?!?!” and a bunch of incoherent senseless bile. There’s a sizeable group of people who deeply love being offended, and it’s not us (queerfolk/LGBTQIA+/QUILTBAG/GSM/whatever). Like, I’m neck-deep in queer over here and every time I play a game with a pronoun selector at the beginning I promptly forget about it but oohhhh nooo, not these bellends. They somehow think a button at the beginning of the game that matters like three times ever has entirely DESTROYED videogames with LIES and FALLACIES 🙄
They’d be a joke and an insignificant oddity if they didn’t deliberately make messes of everything else (say, going to MWLL/other games, ranting about “pronounwarrior,” pretty sure some critters got teamkilled over it…) for no good reason.
They’d be a joke and an insignificant oddity if they didn’t deliberately make messes of everything else
My opinion exactly.
In ways, I actually feel sorry for them. In the first place, it has to suck just to be that angry and spiteful, but underneath that, it must really suck to feel so powerless and desperate and insecure that something as trivial and irrelevant as pronouns can send you into a compensatory rage.
My pity is greatly diminished by the fact that they’re toxic assholes who try to force the world to accommodate their own failures though.
Wait, Battletech? The turn based one? From 2018?
That’s amusing. I played that a couple months ago. I don’t recall ever selecting a pronoun, but I’m sure I did and then just moved on like a normal person.
Yeah, that’s the one. There was so much outrage because it had the word “pronoun” in it at all 🤣It’s just a little thing on the side during character creation and its effect is absolutely trivial. Actually I think the other MechWarriors ‘have pronouns’ too if you deliberately open the character editor for them. It’s really the bare minimum, like I’m trying to come up with something sarcastic but those people were freaking out over nnnnooothing like the one word in one game is gonna ruin videogames for them forever, or some crap.
Which, like… if we could somehow trans so hard they’d go away don’t they think we’d do it instead of just getting yelled at?
Meanwhile, my canonically enby commander is rocking a fabulous magenta mohawk and having fun headshotting all the King Crabs so they can sell them to afford catperson surgery.
Hah! Good luck with that :3
(Same but mine doesn’t have the mohawk and doesn’t specifically hunt KGCs :P . )
I’m not hunting them specifically, their cockpits just happen to be magnets for my Marauder’s laser and autocannon rounds. :P
The first one I saw, in an early “titan” mission, got taken out by a single alpha strike from long range and dropped three salvage. (I renamed it Queen Crab when I noticed that some parts of the mech were white after applying my blue/pink paint scheme.)
I just cannot get over what a terrible name “quiltbag” is. How do you say that out loud and not immediately think better of it?
Well, it’s… pronounceable? Technically?
Okay I don’t actually like it and don’t know anycritter who does but it’s there soooo putting it there seemed like a good idea at the time? 🤷
I’ve seen that in videos, but I always assumed it was for show to get their viewers riled up. I honestly can’t imagine an actual person doing this on their own, unless they were encouraged to do it by some influencer.
As in, how many people fire up a game, get mad that pronouns exist, and then search online for a “fix”? I think that number is pretty small.
But then again, I tend to be pretty careful about distancing myself from bigots.
I think that number’s pretty small too.
I’m just saying that it’s not zero.
Small government alpha males scared of having the option to choose he/him as their pronouns
Mostly the outrage.
I can see someone with a modlist with 252 mods in it adding one just to max it out, and a plugin like this wouldnt conflict with much.
How are these people not seeing that they are actively trying to censor shit with the shyte excuse “keep politics out of my games”, and then turn around and yell censorship as soon as people ignore their bigoted crap.
You don’t need to answer, it’s rhetorical.
Incredibly petty mod to make in the first place, so Nexus might as well be petty too and remove it.
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Nowadays everything seems newsworthy… I would not be mad about it if Bethesda did not include a pronoun setting, i am not mad someone made a mod to remove said option, i am not mad nexus keeping its sovereignty to decide what they host…
What is everyone mad about? Just let ppl do whatever they do.
They finally give you something that controls how people refer to you in their games, and dipshits wanna remove it? This is as close as you’re going to get to having characters refer to you as a choice you’ve taken other than Codsworth and Vasco having like 1000 generic names recorded to use.
Does it even affect dialogue? The PC is hardly ever referred to with pronouns, actually I can’t remember a single line.
I believe it changes enemy barks like “He/She/They shot him!” and maybe a few dialogue lines?
Heh, I like how the enemies are considerate enough to figure out and use the correct pronouns mid-battle
Hey, you! What are your pronouns? … Thanks, now eat lead!
I might be a paid killer, but I’ll be damned if I’ll misgender someone. Professionals have standards.
They definitely use your pronouns a lot. It’s all they refer to you as, aside from cute nicknames like “Dusty,” or “rook” or “renegade.” Probably doesn’t stand out if you chose your normal pronouns, since they’d just be say he/him or she/her or they/them.
A security officer referred to me as sir in New Atlantis.
We can’t be far from text-to-speech tweaking a ton of voice acting. Might have to pronounce or IPA your custom name, to get an AI voice to nail it… but maybe it’s better-off being wrong. There’s disarming verisimilitude in schmaltzy NPCs confidently fumbling your character’s name. Or if some characters heard it, but haven’t seen it, and you catch some mutter ‘so that’s how it’s spelled.’
Whether that name is Paarthurnax, Heloise, or Ng.
I am just picturing the orc noble who uses words incorrectly/mispronounces shit. Forgot what those are called, but they have similar characters in most of their games. In Starfield, they even called him “Dumbrosky.” Dumb Bro ski.
Malapropisms.
As someone with a generic name, fuck you!
I mean, I sorta get it. Identity politics are political and often divisive, and some people don’t want it in their escapism.
It’s not a perfect analogy, but if a role-playing game had a mandatory character-selection choice to choose if my character was pro-choice or pro-life, I could see myself mildly resenting it.Not really a good example. A more apt example is if these people were getting angry that the character creator allowed a player to create a woman, or a person of colour. The game offering you a choice of pronouns is not asking you for a political opinion, it’s literally just an option to create a type of character that these people don’t think should exist.
And that’s the crux of it, they aren’t angry about pronouns, they’re angry about trans and non-binary people becoming normalised.
I dunno, being a man, woman, or black person isn’t political. Trans, non-binary, etc is, and normalizing it is political, regardless of if it’s right or wrong. I think that you’re correct and that it seems like something done as ammunition in the Culture War; normalizing identity politics rather than a design decision done out of a necessity to improve the quality of the game apart from that.
My earlier analogy was about having a pro-life/pro-choice option forced on you, but I guess to make it more accurate it would be more like the game just telling you that you’re pro-life as part of your character settings? Because it’s not just putting the politics in the game, it’s taking a strong side. Again, rightly or wrongly, I can see why some people would resent that in their escapism.
Trans people: Exist
Brainlets: “Is this politics??”
I guess my existence is “political” then, I guess I can’t exist in a space without having something “forced” on people.
We were male/female, now we’re women/men/other, that’s it. It’s a personal matter that we go through and we want to simply exist. That’s only “political” when your dealing with people who actively want to harm our rights. I cannot stress enough that these people shouldn’t be treated with respect as if they’re not trying to destroy people for a simple personal choice.
I dunno, being a man, woman, or black person isn’t political. Trans, non-binary, etc is, and normalizing it is political, regardless of if it’s right or wrong.
Women and black people getting the right to vote and be treated equally has always been “political” you fucking jackass.
I dunno, being a man, woman, or black person isn’t political.
I agree, they should not be, but people still try and make them political.
Trans, non-binary, etc is
No. Absolutely not. Trans people and non-binary people are types of people who exist. Exactly the same as men, women, people of colour, and so forth. They are no more or less political than those other types of people. People still make them political, but that’s exactly the same thing as with other groups.
My earlier analogy was about having a pro-life/pro-choice option forced on you, but I guess to make it more accurate it would be more like the game just telling you that you’re pro-life as part of your character settings? Because it’s not just putting the politics in the game, it’s taking a strong side. Again, rightly or wrongly, I can see why some people would reset that in their escapism.
You are mistaken. There is no political opinion here. None is being asked for, and none is being assigned. The character creator having additional options is just allowing players to make trans or non-binary characters. This isn’t asking you for a political opinion, it’s simply adding options to create more types of characters.
Which is why the bigots are upset. Because they don’t think those types of characters should be allowed to be made.
Whether or not it should be, isn’t LGBT issues political/controversial?
As are women and people of colour, and their inclusion in media. These are all demographics of people. There is no difference.
There’s no difference between a movie casting a woman/black man as the main character, compared to casting a trans person?
Whether or not it should be, isn’t LGBT issues political/controversial?
Simply acknowledging LGBT exist
- isn’t political
- helps make it less political
Of course it’s political. Politics aren’t just about things where there can be legitimate disagreement.
Acknowledging climate change is political. So is everything from basic public transport, better healthcare to if sexism and racism are even a thing.
It shouldn’t be. We also shouldn’t have a resurgence of actual fascists. But we do and it is.
being a man, woman, or black person isn’t political
Being a woman isn’t political… until I do it? Kinda seems like there’s no actually valid (sound? I forget the terminology) argument for how our existence is a problem, nor for how supporting or acknowledging our existence is a problem.
I don’t actually quite understand what you’re on about but it kinda seems like you’re arguing that allowing people to play characters that don’t match your preferences exactly is some kind of forced political thing and that’s kinda horsecrap, y’know?
Anyway I’m gonna go exist at that bigot up there now. Byeee ö/
Aside from you being transphobic, you should realize that the people complaining about pronouns are also the people who complain about the “replaced white people” and “female leaders” in the game. So I guess black people and women are also political, by your logic?
The best bigots are the ones that tell on themselves, dontcha think?
Fuck off forever
Terrible analogy. It’s just turning the binary male / female into non binary body types & pronouns to be more inclusive for those who fall outside the norm on the spectrum of things.
I wouldn’t. I mean, I hate Nazis but I don’t mind a game where I can choose to play as one (so long as the context makes sense like it’s a multiplayer WW2 game or Diso Elysium). It’s a fuckin’ choice. If you don’t like one of the options: Choose a different one.
I used to have a lot of respect for Az from HeelVsBabyface as a content creator back when he did WoW videos. Many of the fanboys who play Blizzard games dismissed him as a whiny bitch when he complained about issues with the game long before other more respected creators (i.e. Bellular, Asmongold, Sodapoppin, Preach) jumped on the very same ‘fuck Blizzard’ bandwagon.
Watched him a lot less after he branched away from WoW stuff because his content was more anti-woke and not really of my interest.
His two minute anti-pronoun rant made him look like a clown and was the last straw that made me unsub to his YouTube and unfollow him on X.
What people like Az seem to forget is that Starfield is set hundreds of years in the future. I can understand why a pronoun selection menu would look out of place in a medieval setting like The Elder Scrolls, but not in a game set 300 years in the future.
Also, nobody is forcing you to play as a trans or non-binary character. This is not discrimination against white men as Az pointed out in his nonsensical rant. You can make a white male character that identifies with he/him pronouns and not be placed at a disadvantage in the game.
